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US election: it's far from over

Andrew Stephen

Published 04 June 2008

Either candidacy could implode instantly, at any time, as the result of a gaffe or some unguarded moment. Obama must watch his hubris, McCain his temper

So, barring political earthquakes in the next three months - a phenomenon that we should by no means rule out - this year's presidential election on 4 November will not be as different as we once thought it might be. The choice facing the nation when it goes to the polls to pick its 44th president will be between two men in suits and ties, just as it has always been since the tradition was established 220 years ago.

Do not be misled by all the romanticised buzz about youth and change, either: if Senator Barack Obama moves into the White House on 20 January he will be less than three years from his sixth decade, older than (say) Bill Clinton was when he became the last Democratic president in 1993. If it is John McCain who triumphs in November, he will be fewer than eight years from his ninth decade - the oldest man to become US president.

In other ways, it will be business much as usual: each man went to elite private high schools, Obama proceeding further down the path of private education all the way to the Ivy Leagues, while McCain followed family tradition and joined the highly exclusive US Naval Academy. Each man has a background that certainly deviates from the historical norm, however. McCain, for example, was born in Panama - an overseas birth that theoretically disqualifies him from becoming president under the US constitution but is overlooked because he was born in a US naval facility. Uniquely for a US presidential candidate, Obama's upbringing and adolescence were spent outside mainland America, four years of it abroad; the young McCain, as the son and grandson of four-star naval admirals, spent many school holidays overseas at different US bases around the world, too.

Assuming the two men are formally ratified as the Democratic and Republican Party nominees at the end of August and beginning of September respectively, the battle that follows will be just as enthralling a roller coaster as the five months of the primary season have been. Either candidacy could implode instantly as the result of a gaffe or some unguarded moment: Obama's because of his potentially explosive blend of personal arrogance and political inexperience, McCain's because of his political erraticism, limited stamina and notorious hot temper. The sparks, we can be sure, will fly.

I will return to these potentially exciting scenarios shortly. Before that, however, let me re-emphasise something the US media found impossible even to countenance as the results of the last two 2008 primaries in South Dakota and Montana were coming in on Tuesday night (fittingly, Obama won Montana and Clinton took South Dakota by almost identical margins, by the way): that the democratic process in selecting the Democratic Party nominee, following the party's rules and procedures, is far from over and won't actually conclude until 28 August.


Hillary Clinton

A pensive Hillary Clinton after the result. What will she do next?



Yet the gleeful, mounting expectation among the US punditocracy last Tuesday that Hillary Clinton would gracefully concede to Obama, obediently pack up her bags and hand the battle over to the big boys was stupendous to behold. MSNBC's über-commentator Keith Olbermann said perfectly seriously that this presumptuous female had tried to "shoehorn" her way to the Democratic nomination. There was universal dismay that Clinton did not shush her supporters when they chanted "Denver! Denver! Denver!" as she spoke in New York on Tuesday night, an unmistakable exhortation that she should continue the fight all the way to the Pepsi Centre convention floor in Denver in August.

I do not know (and I don't believe Clinton knows herself, at least not as I write this in the early hours of Wednesday) whether she will accept the vice-presidential nomination. She and Obama certainly loathe each other, but there is a long tradition in US politics of presidential candidates and their running mates regarding each other with contempt (for example, JFK and LBJ). I previously suggested in these pages that the denouement of this year's epic Obama-Clinton battle could come when planeloads of Obama lawyers and Clinton lawyers fly in to Denver to fight over the legal intricacies of the nominating procedures. That remains a long-shot scenario, but one that is still not inconceivable.

The reasons should be obvious even to the complacent US punditocracy, but they are not. If this five-month season of primaries and caucuses has taught us anything, it is that the absurd, outdated and ludicrously complex and contradictory procedures that govern US elections badly need to be updated and rationalised. (British enthusiasts who want to introduce UK primaries: please listen to me on this.)

It is simply outrageous, for example, that the validity of millions of votes cast in Michigan and Florida should remain in legal limbo merely because there are so many senseless rules and traditions. There is no good reason in the world, to give another, why the first caucus and primary contests of every presidential campaign must be in Iowa and New Hampshire, respectively, rather than in, say, Florida or Michigan. Hillary Clinton may have trounced Obama by a staggering 68-32 landslide in the Democratic primary in Puerto Rico on 1 June, but even though the island's four million residents are US citizens, they will be denied the right to vote in the 4 November election. So why should Puerto Ricans help choose the candidates in primaries, but then not be allowed to vote for any of them in November? Nobody seems to know; that's just how it is.

Countless anomalies of this kind do not normally matter, but when the race is extremely close - as it was when poor Al Gore won the popular vote for the US presidency in 2000 but then, under the arcane electoral college system and nudged along a bit by the Supreme Court, found George W Bush heading for the White House instead - they can actually end up being phenomenally destructive. The 2000 presidential election was close to being a dead heat, but Bush took advantage of the electoral anomalies to thwart the wishes of the majority of Americans who had voted for Gore to be their president.

The outcome of the 2008 Democratic primary season is remarkably similar: in effect it is a dead heat, too, although just as George W Bush legi timately garnered more electoral college seats under that antiquated system in 2000, so Obama has legitimately won more delegates under the impenetrably complex Democratic primary procedures this year.

Powerfully persuasive


Yet, just about whatever way you calculate the figures now, it is clear that more Americans actually cast their vote for Hillary Clinton to be the Democratic nominee than for Obama. She, poor woman, is the Al Gore of 2008. Had the Democrats run their primaries and caucuses in the same way as the Republicans, to give another example of the contrariness of the system, Clinton would have wrapped up the nomination long ago.

That, first, helps explain why she did not immediately curtsy to Obama and concede defeat in the humiliatingly defeatist manner so many were eagerly awaiting last Tuesday night. Bush, had Gore made it to the White House instead of him in 2000, would doubtless have suffered the same bitterness and resentment over being cheated of the presidency that subsequently afflicted Gore. In much the same way, both Obama and Clinton have every right to feel that they have emerged from the 2008 primary season as the people's choice for the Democratic nomination.

In American sporting parlance, Clinton had a terrible second quarter in which she ceded 13 successive victories to Obama in a losing streak that began on Super Tuesday (5 February) and ended in Vermont a month later. But her other three quarters have been strong, and she roared to recent landslide victories in West Virginia, Kentucky and Puerto Rico. She beat Obama in six of the nation's giant seven states, such as California, New York and Texas, and in a majority of other battleground states that could be decisive in November. No presidential candidate in history has ever lost six of the country's seven largest states in the primaries, as Obama has done, and gone on to win the White House.

That brings us to the second main reason why Clinton has not dutifully slunk away: she and her husband can still make powerfully persuasive arguments to the 789 super-delegates that she has a better chance of beating McCain in November than Obama. Even after the final primaries were over on 3 June, and weeks after the media had anointed Obama as the nominee, polls still showed that Clinton would beat McCain in November more easily than Obama. The super-delegates are leaning strongly to Obama and there may well now be an unstoppable exodus to him - but there is nothing to stop them changing their minds until the die is finally cast in Denver on 28 August.

If Clinton does not concede or accept the vice-presidential nomination, or decide the battle is lost, we can thus be certain that the Clinton camp will keep pounding away in private at the super-delegates about why she would be the better candidate until the very last moment on 28 August - simultaneously keeping their fingers crossed that good fortune, in the form of a major Obama gaffe or the exposure of a hitherto unrevealed skeleton in his cupboard, will swing their way.

The latest gossip, for example - and this is not from the Clinton camp - is that the McCain campaign has got hold of dynamite video footage of Obama's wife, Michelle, derisively dismissing "whitey" alongside Louis Farrakhan, the notoriously anti-Semitic leader of the Nation of Islam, at Obama's former so-called "buppie" church in Chicago (from which he chose to resign, in cidentally, only last Sunday). Heaven knows whether this rumour is true, but its very existence is indicative of the political volatility we can expect for the next six months. McCain is no racist, but (assuming Obama is his opponent) he is a former military boxer who will not pull his punches in the way that Clinton, as a fellow Democrat obliged to preach party unity, has felt she must do.

Yet things may well turn very ugly when the Republicans march into battle. The evil admen who managed to transform John Kerry's public image in a matter of days in the 2004 campaign from a genuine Vietnam War hero into an effete, French-speaking windsurfer will have nil compunction in trying to destroy Obama, too. Obama will constantly have to keep his hubris in check, McCain his temper. The dramas of this election year, I can assure you, are far from over.

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74 comments from readers

Europhobe
04 June 2008 at 10:46

More bitterness towards the US from the NS...

Robert Powell
04 June 2008 at 10:59

A balanced comment there from the Europhobe. Actually wasn't this article more anti-Obama and the Washington-mediaocracy than anti the US? There are quite a few Americans who would agree - does that make them anti-America? Why don't people engage with the issues rather than projecting their own bitterness on everyone else! We care about the politics in America in Europe because it affects us - especially when you get morons like Tony Blair toeing the line set out by religious imperialists like George W! The real legacy his successor will have to deal with is the beginning of the end of the US as a superpower because his failure of policy has allowed the Chinese (and their hideous government) to get a foothold in Africa and elsewhere and because his failure of policy in Iraq has severely strengthened the arm of reactionary Islamic extremists.

Iconoclast
04 June 2008 at 11:51

What if McCain kicks the bucket? Isn't Ron Paul still running? Could be interesting.

antileft
04 June 2008 at 11:52

"The choice facing the nation when it goes to the polls to pick its 44th president will be between two men in suits-and-ties, just as it has always been since the tradition was established 220 years ago."

What an absolutely moronic comment. The first black candidate almost lost to the first female candidate- a historic and unique result- and yes, both nominees wear suits and ties. What's the problem?

Indiana
04 June 2008 at 13:31

Once again, Mr. Stephen, you have it exactly right. Thank you and could you please give the American "journalists" some tips on how to practice journalism? People in America seem to have forgotten what impartial, thorough, and objective journalism looks like. Democracy cannot exist without good objective journalism.

Isabel
04 June 2008 at 13:48

Mr Andrew Stephen’s article is surprisingly bias and anti-Obama and while I understand that this is his point of view it should be noted that even bias arguments still need to be well founded – and his arguments are simply ill conceived.

In his article there is for example no mention of the equally preposterous notion that it is fair to include the votes that were cast in Michigan even when one of the key candidates name was not even in the ballot paper. But this is by the by, because more importantly Andrew Stephen has failed to apply the ‘business as usual’ argument to Hillary Clinton – a woman in the mould (if no necessary completely the politics) of our own Margaret Thatcher in the UK with the only main difference being that Hillary is in fact many times richer and more ‘part off’ the establishment to begin with that M Thatcher ever was when she began her political career. In other words, Andrew Stephen partisanship has blinded him to the fact that in truth, and in terms of real policies by the time the US president is elected the real ‘differences’ between all the candidates (Hillary or Obama and McCain) will be in degrees of emphasis and style rather than real substance because essentially the current electoral systems of developed nations (including supporting machinery, media, vested interests etc. etc.) will never allow anything other than external personal differences to challenge that status quo and sadly though our planet desperately needs it, this is not going to change in 2008.

Jane Greene
04 June 2008 at 14:55

Oh where to start Isabel...

"even bias arguments still need to be well founded" - erm well first of all it's "even biasED arguments..." but the idea of balanced, well founded bias? I mean come on! Then there's the questionable portrayal of Margaret 'she was only a shopkeeper's daughter' Thatcher. By the time she began her political career she'd married a bloke who owned a castle. You couldn't be more part of the establishment than Thatcher simply because (as a former outsider) she tried so damned hard at joining it from her silly accent through her right regal hairdo right down to her Royal 'we have become a grandmother'. In fact she would never have got on as a woman in the 1950s from her social background if she hadn't joined so thoroughly. She carried it through her politics with her ungracious tendency to trample the faces of people she'd beaten in the mud when she was PM. Isn't the point of Andrew Stephen's article that there will be nothing that new about this campaign, now? Where you are probably right is it wouldn't have been much different if it had been Hillary either!

antileft
04 June 2008 at 15:11

"erm well first of all it's "even biasED arguments"

Typical. Pick on someone's spelling mistakes or grammar: It's the usual way a moron uses to avoid dealing with an arguement that they arent bright enough to win.

And she didnt say that thatcher wasnt rich, or part of the establishment- she said that she was LESS rich and LESS a part of the establishment. Which again, isnt relevant anyway, because what she is saying is that Clinton is a part of the establishment- Thatcher isnt who we're talking about here- again, youre distracting from the debate with random superficial nonsense because you arent bright enough to win it.

And why would you expect clinton to be particularly different from obama?! Theyre both from the same party! Theyre expected to see eye to eye on most things.

By the way, the reason politics seems to be superficial and meaningless now is because certain journalists choose not to write about policies (here is no exception), and the reason for that is that most voters are like you- more interested in gaffs (or grammatical errors, or how things are said rather than substance) than they are in policy. Theyre also not bright enough to understand policies.

Go ahead- make fun of my spelling mistakes/grammar. Itll make you sound smarter than you are.

Isabel
04 June 2008 at 15:27

Jane thank you for the post and annotations about typos…it seems to me that we probably agree in the salient point I was making, though you clearly read my post to be something it is not about M Thatcher.

I do not dispute any of your points – but as you would appreciate, I felt no need to make those points in the context of my post, as its main purpose was to emphasise that all current runners/candidates for the US presidency are part of the establishment and that if for some strange reason one of them still had an independent thought come November the establishment machinery will ensure that that individual is not elected.

Btw, a person can have biased views and these views can still be well founded, researched, and postulated because these concepts are not mutually exclusive if you truly take into account the real nature of all human beings! In fact, I am not a believer in the mythical and lesser spotted ‘impartial coverage’ principally because it doesn’t exist whatever the BBC, CNN et al would like to have us believe.

I hope this explains my position.

Regards

Isabel
04 June 2008 at 15:36

Antileft – thank you for the post.

Reading many of your posts it is clear to me that we have very different political view points, but I appreciate your desire to challenge the snobbery that inhabits these spaces.

Regards

Jane Greene
04 June 2008 at 16:09

It's curious antileft because I'm pretty sure you've tried to pick people up on their use of language before. You've also paraded as an ex-Venezuela resident living in Japan with American (as US) connections but the other day you wrote a post in which you clearly betrayed yourself as a British resident and voter. Now you're always very rude to people using words like moron and idiot aplenty. Is your bitterness because you're a bit of a tiny tim?

antileft
04 June 2008 at 16:24

No, I havent picked anyone up because of their language- go check. Really, its not that complicated. Yes, Ive lived in venezuela and Japan. No, I dont have US connections (I never said I did- go check). All of which doesnt contradict the fact that Im a british voter, does it?

And, again, instead of actually debating the points intellectually, youre being typically moronic. Tiny tim- oh very intellectual. Go back to watching TV and drinking beer, bonehead.

Jane Greene
04 June 2008 at 17:00

Mmm that's right. Just sitting back with a brew watching the football. As for intellectual, don't make me laugh. Why bother when you are involved?

antileft
04 June 2008 at 17:09

Yes indeed- you wouldnt want to be made to look like an idiot without any opinions, would you? It's best that you simply accept your place. Enjoy the football, and of course, the "piss up" that follows.

Jane Greene
04 June 2008 at 17:54

So sad. So alone. Still, you've got all your friends on the web.

Isabel
04 June 2008 at 18:03

Antileft - to go back to the article and my point ….there are no real differences in terms of policy between any of the candidates and the status quo will be maintained whoever is elected. Only today in his first major foreign policy speech Obama outlined his Israel Policy which to put it simply is = to Reagan’s = G Bush Senior’s = B Clinton’s = G.W’s and = McCain/H Clinton’s.

Now, you said that that the media doesn’t want to talk about real policies, but you see the problem is that under the surface there aren’t any policy differences and the media know it. So all we get is a lot of froth about sexism, racism, ageism etc. Of course these issues are still a problem in the US and around the world, and will no doubt influence many voters in November, but the substance (or lack of it) is in the policies and in this area the real differences do not amount to much = (No) Change We Can Believe In.

antileft
04 June 2008 at 18:05

Oh dear Jane, you are desperate!! All you know is that I travel, and that Im too intelligent for you to debate me. Trying to get personal with me (yet again) is a bit pathetic- it just shows how desperate you are to score some kind of points against me. It's a shame youre not bright enough to do it intellectually, isnt it? As someone you know nothing about, it's little more than amuzing to me. Maybe you should try insulting my mother now, or better yet, maybe you should try calling me gay? Yes, thatd sting, wouldnt it?!! It'd also conveniently deflect attention away from the fact that you arent bright enough to have any real opinions that you can debate.

antileft
04 June 2008 at 18:18

Isabel, I agree with you to a degree. However, I see it differently. Most of the people are not interested in serious debate- that's why a lot of the media focuses on race, sex, etc. More intellectual media, however, does focus on policies- you just wont find it here.

Differences- Obama and clinton are very similar, as you would expect from two people in the same party. The differences between them are no more than they are between blair and brown. However, there are some fairly small differences in substance there. Foreign policy is one (speaking to iran is a big deal even though its just speaking). The gas tax could maybe even have been the thing that finally sunk clinton.

To say that the republicans and the democrats are the same though- that really is nonsense. All you have to do is look at what would happen if a supreme court judge were to retire under Mcain. Everything would change. Similarly, foreign policy is completely different under obama and mcain. Healthcare again is completely different- mcain is interested in cost, obama is interested in inclusion. And there are many other differences. Can you imagine what would happen if one of the next three court justices to retire (all liberals) were replaced by a conservative?! You cant tell me that theyre the same.

DarylS
04 June 2008 at 20:35

I can't even get through an Andrew Stephen article anymore. They are all the same. Is he still gonna be talking about Hillary in November even if she is not the VP Candidate.

Mr Stephen, I am still waiting for one of your predictions to be proven correct.

Dimbulb
04 June 2008 at 20:37

As an American, I find it highly embarrassing, to say the least, that I have to be directed to The New Statesman to find commentary that actually correctly states how the American presidential nomination system works -- neither candidate won sufficient pledged delegates to win a majority on the first ballot (regardless of what happened with Florida and Michigan), and consequently the nomination won't actually be determined until the Convention in Denver, whereupon the 800-odd superdelegates, whatever their previously stated preference, cast a binding vote on the first ballot. Many thanks, but if the comments are any guide no one over here in Britain is really paying attention, either.

Obama/Hillary_Supporter
04 June 2008 at 22:12

Here he goes again. Andrew Stephen has got to be one of the worst political reporters in the media. His obsession with Hillary Clinton is completely blinding him to the truth of the matter that she lost. He took an article that should have been about the coming Obama/McCain clash and turned it into a raving anti-Obama piece of crap. His bitterness over the fact that Obama has one even effects his memory. In case Andrew's forgotten the elections between Gore and Bush were in 2000 and concluded in 2001.

frenchie
04 June 2008 at 23:40

What a stunningly accurate and insightful analysis of our Presidential campaign this is. Thank you so much, the New Statesmen. If only more articles like this could be published in newspapers across the USA, we would have a much-better functioning democracy. In this case, too few Americans realize that Hillary Clinton actually won more votes than Barack Obama, yet lost the nomination. Bravo! Andrew Stephens understands this country and its politics better than all our own commentators put together. It's sad that should be the case, but at least Americans now have the chance to read the New Statesmen on the web.

nancytc
05 June 2008 at 01:30

My two cents: If Obama does not offer the VP position to Hillary Clinton, then he is making a BIG mistake. Hillary Clinton won the POPULAR VOTE, which for some reason we were all fighting for when Al Gore was running.

Why may I ask is it different now? Is it because Hillary Clinton is a female that we Americans think she should get out of the race, when people like Teddy Kennedy went all the way to the convention when he didn't even have half as much delegates or popular vote than Hillary?

History really does repeat itself. Women can go through the pains of child birth and child rearring, but when it comes time for them to achieve a goal they worked all their life to achieve they are knocked down. Women had to wait until the white man and black man decided it was their time to vote and I am so sick and tired of seeing the 'good old boy's' get their way every time.

I will not vote for Obama. I cannot afford his plans for our economy with a hike in the capital gains tax to 30% or his approval to allow credit card companies to charge any interest they want. I will not vote for him because his health care plan does not include all citizens, which is money out of my pocket to pay for those who do not want insurance. I will not vote for him because he is a double talker and does not know that Iran is a country, which needs to be kept under control. I will not vote for him because his minister and his wife have total disregard for white people. I will not vote for him because he is associated with a sexist priest, who should not have just been suspended, but he should have been dismissed as a Priest and no longer allowed to wear the cloth of God. I will not vote for him because he is associated with Farrakhan, who believes Jews should not exist. I will not vote for him because he does not Pledge his Allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America.

I will vote for Hillary Clinton if she runs as an Independant or if she is on the ticket with John McCain.

aloanstar
05 June 2008 at 02:23

Andrew, thanks for another great article. As you can tell, not everyone agrees with you especially if you aren't raving over Obama the why they do in American media outlets. Of course you don't really have to say anything negative about him, you just have to say anything positive about Hillary and that is taken as a slap in the face to his supporters. I am glad that you tackled the asinine, archaic way elections are ran in the US. If you really want to be dismayed, take a closer look at Texas's "two step" plan. We have a primary, then a caucus that lasted until after 1am in some precincts, then 3 more conventions to narrow down the delegates before the Democratic convention in August. We had not even held the first convention when delegates started being handed out to Obama. Hillary won the popular vote in our primary by over 100,000 votes, he ended up with more delegates after the caucus and we don't even have an end to the caucus results until this weekend. THAT is amazing and I will never understand the reasoning. We (Texans) drag our elecion out from mid-Feb, with early voting, through mid-June. We vote twice, because you can't vote in the caucus if you didn't vote in the primary. I know people say "there is a reason for everything", but there couldn't be. Anyway, I always love reading your articles and you have a way of writing that flows really well and stays on subject...whether other people appreciate it or not, you have them coming back for more.

amalk
05 June 2008 at 02:43

When I left Britain 30 years ago the New Statesman was a left wing publication I believe. Andrew Stephen illustrates what it means now to be left wing back home. I guess Blair got to him - Blair like Clinton took both their parties right of centre - or do you even say center now? Just look at who else Stephen writes for - The Sunday Times?? He's a Rupert Murdoch man! Of course he's anti-Obama and he's waaay off course. I don't think The Observer would give him his job back. Murdoch's daughter seems to know a good thing when she sees one (hosting a fundraiser for Obama in London) but Daddy likes Fox news to support Republicans and/or the winning horse - which Rupert expected to be Hillary. Murdoch the money and Hillary still has lots and lots of influence with the Jewish community and in New York. Murdoch has big big ambitions in the news world - still. He wants to be Hearst. Stephens is under orders to keep New Yorkers and rich Americans camping in London sweet. This article is so leaning right.

cpark3r
05 June 2008 at 03:59

I believe it is incorrect to say the Clinton won more votes than Obama. That seems to be true only if the votes in Michigan and Florida are counted and if the caucus states that Obama won are not included in his tally.

So I really have to question the comparisons to the 2000 elections A.S. raises. Clinton will conceed to Obama in due on Friday. And while I think this article does point out many of Obama's weakness as a candidate, I dont think a struggle with Clinton is among them.

antileft
05 June 2008 at 04:47

"Hillary Clinton won the POPULAR VOTE, which for some reason we were all fighting for when Al Gore was running. Why may I ask is it different now? Is it because Hillary Clinton is a female..."

What a load of moronic crap. Primaries dont work according to the popular vote- they arent made for it. You compete for DELEGATES- not the popular vote. Very few elections actually work according to the popular vote anyway- Britain doesnt either. You cant ignore the rules just because your side lost. Imagine if there was a hung parliament in Britain, and the tories said "you know what? We won the popular vote but the system is rigged, so let's just agree that actually we won by a landslide". You can disagree with the rules all you want- but the time to disagree with them is BEFORE the thing starts- not after your candidate loses. Clinton should have known that.

And besides, why would you count florida and michigan where neither candidate campaigned (which of course benefits clinton because everyone's heard of her)? Before the contest began all candidates specifically agreed that those two states wouldnt be counted because they broke party rules. Clinton agreed. She signed, and she verbally accepted it. She was happy with it before she started losing. Why change the rules later? Honestly, some people are so incredibly dumb, its hard to even know where to begin. "It's because, like me, she's a woman!" Bonehead. Quit voting according to your gender.

DarylS
05 June 2008 at 09:16

How can they seriously let someone so right-wing write for the New Statesman, without it being labelled "the Other-side" or something.

The Independent newspaper I have actually found since the editorship of the Statesman changed is a far better representation of views and issues from the left.

antileft
05 June 2008 at 09:30

Well, you must be pretty extreme, then. I recommend reading something which doesnt simply confirm everything that you already knew.

Isabel
05 June 2008 at 10:40

Well it seems Hillary is out of the race – or at least that is what was intimated by her team today/yesterday.

Antileft: I agree with you about the issue of the rules – Obama won by the rules as they currently exist in the Democratic Party and though they may be strong arguments to change them to make them fairer in future contests, it is pointless to claim the current result void and unfair because the candidate many people supported did not win by the application of those rules. It is the equivalent of playing a football game and then for the losing side to ask that they should still be declared the winners because the result was close and they had more supporters in the stadium.

Antileft: to go back to our earlier discussion about small differences not just within the Democrats but also between Democrats and Republicans. Take Obama for example, he started on the ‘left’ of the Democratic Party in terms of foreign policy, the economy, big government, abortion, etc, etc. all the ingredients of a traditional liberal in the US and Old Labour in the UK. As soon as he secured the nomination he began to migrate to the centre-right in terms of policy. Foreign policy was the first to go, then it will be the issue taxation on high earners, and he will then moderate his stance on big government. By the time November comes apart from abortion, they will be little to choose between McCain and Obama in terms of policies. This is not bad faith on the part of politicians (she says in optimistic tone) but political expediency as to go back to my original point modern capitalist democracies with their huge vested interests, lobbies and powerful pressure groups will never allow anyone with radical leftish political programmes to be elected. This is not to say that they will not be differences in terms of emphasis and social programmes if say Obama gets elected as opposed to McCain, but in the big scheme of things this will inevitably end up being quite insignificant.

Isabel
05 June 2008 at 10:48

Btw, when Churchill won the election in 1951 he got less actual votes than C Attlee but he was still declared PM - he won according to the rules!

Isabel
05 June 2008 at 11:44

Just in case it was not clear to our American friends posting here – many of us do actually realise that the contest is not ‘officially’ over until Denver or until the lady says that she officially retires!

Isabel
05 June 2008 at 11:54

In terms of Mr Stephen’s journalistic ethos one has to seriously question his motivation when he decided (very disingenuously) to include damaging "gossip" about Obama and his wife as per extract below:

"The latest gossip, for example - and this is not from the Clinton camp - is that the McCain campaign has got hold of dynamite video footage of Obama's wife, Michelle, derisively dismissing "whitey" alongside Louis Farrakhan, the notoriously anti-Semitic leader of the Nation of Islam, at Obama's former so-called "buppie" church in Chicago (from which he chose to resign, in cidentally, only last Sunday). Heaven knows whether this rumour is true, but its very existence is indicative of the political volatility we can expect for the next six months. McCain is no racist, but (assuming Obama is his opponent) he is a former military boxer who will not pull his punches in the way that Clinton, as a fellow Democrat obliged to preach party unity, has felt she must do."

afyassin
05 June 2008 at 12:56

I think the slant of Stephen's opinion is so slanted against Obama, an African-American. I wonder what if Obama is "white" and not "black how would the slant be? nd he should get the facts correct especially the statitistcs. Is he being fair when one of the cadidtates does not have his name in the ballot paper as in Michigan. And how about the caucuses.

antileft
05 June 2008 at 15:20

"As soon as he secured the nomination he began to migrate to the centre-right in terms of policy....but political expediency as to go back to my original point modern capitalist democracies with their huge vested interests, lobbies and powerful pressure groups will never allow anyone with radical leftish political programmes to be elected."

I agree that he ll sound a lot more like Mcain by the end of the process. But you think that this is because of "vested interests". How so? It sounds to me as though he's trying to please the people who will vote for him.

Of course, there is a lot of lobbying by different groups and companies (a bad thing which is an issue in America- and as it's an issue, one can be hopeful that there may eventually be reform). But the thing that prevents "radical leftish political programs" is simply that most Americans consider themselves to be right wing. (This is a statistic Ive heard many times, by the way. There are very few "radical leftists"). And I have to say- a developed political system should not move to radical extremes. If the system more or less works, as it does in America, then radicalism is not something that makes sense. The health system doesnt work- but here, the people dont think that the answer is on the left- but on the right. And they dont want something radical. You may disagree with them here (I do too- I think they need a health service) but it is democratic, and it is sensible not to jump from one extreme to the next.

"By the time November comes apart from abortion, they will be little to choose between McCain and Obama in terms of policies"

Apart from abortion? Again, what would happen if a liberal justice of the supreme court were replaced by a conservative? Let's take a look.

-Yes, abortion could be banned. That's a major, radical change.

-Gay marriage would be even less likely.

-Creationism is very likely to be taught in schools.

-Guantanemo bay trials, the erosion of civil liberties in the name of "anti-terrorism" and other similar things would all be a lot easier.

Do I need to go on? Everything would be effected. It's not just abortion. The reading of the constitution would change.

Now, again, the differences between the two shouldnt be huge. You wont get a socialist vs a capitalist. This is a good thing- both parties aim for the centre ground. It makes sense in a modern democracy (and it is very democratic). Unnecessary radical change is a bad thing and if you can avoid it then it creates stability. It's no surprise that when Britain's left wing party became pro-market everyone started investing. Just the threat of a radical left takeover is understandably enough to put of businesses. If most of the big decisions have been reached, then that's good news. Most western countries have already decided, after many decades of difficulties and feuding, that the radical left doesnt work. This is a good thing and allows us to illiminate that choice. Everything is more stable as a result.

cpark3r
05 June 2008 at 15:42

I think it misses the mark to say that there will be little difference between Obama and McCain by the time the first Tuesday in November arrives. It doesn't surprise me that both candidates will make adjustments to their platforms to try and appeal to a wider base of voters. The way the numbers are shaping up, McCain and Obama are very close and we won't be seeing a landside victory for either candidate. Each is doing what all politicians do - saying what they need to say to get elected.

Whats more important than the policy of the individual candidate are all the other people that cadidate will be bringing to Washington. We are looking at several Supreme Court retirees in the next few years - those are the people who will actually decide the abortion issue - not Obama. And that is just the tip of the iceberg. It has always astonsished me how many people come and go from Washington everytime there is a change in administration. This is especially true when it involves a change in party. It is truly an exodus.

So while McCain and Obama my not be polar opposites in their rhetoric, the neocon footsoldiers of the Republican party will all lose their jobs if Obama wins in November. That will make a much greater change in what happens in Washington than anything a President could do alone.

tancop
05 June 2008 at 16:36

Can I point out that there was no Presidential election in 2002 as AS repeatedly asserts. And publishing unsubstantiated rumours is nothing short of shameful. Honestly, much as I like and often read the New Statesman, the new editor must do something about US coverage, especially now that it is impossible to campaign for Hillary. No-one in the UK or US could take this seriously. I can't recommend that you fire AS, but at least get him some help. The man is hopeless.

antileft
05 June 2008 at 16:37

By the way, I find this incredibly weak too:

"The latest gossip, for example - and this is not from the Clinton camp - is that the McCain campaign has got hold of dynamite video footage of Obama's wife, Michelle, derisively dismissing "whitey" alongside Louis Farrakhan, the notoriously anti-Semitic leader of the Nation of Islam, at Obama's former so-called "buppie" church in Chicago (from which he chose to resign, in cidentally, only last Sunday). Heaven knows whether this rumour is true, but its very existence is indicative of the political volatility we can expect for the next six months. McCain is no racist, but (assuming Obama is his opponent) he is a former military boxer who will not pull his punches in the way that Clinton, as a fellow Democrat obliged to preach party unity, has felt she must do."

Honestly, it's like in Fox news when they cut to some idiot hick out on his ranch who says "I heard that he's a muslim!"

It's just tacky journalism, isnt it? This is just Fox News for the left.

usg
05 June 2008 at 16:47

As a long-time reader of the New Statesman, I have express agreement with Tancop's comment. It's not that I object to Andrew Stephen's views per se (though I think reproducing racist rumours is unhelpful at best), but I think the New Statesman has made itself appear not only contrarian and but also distinctly cultish by only publishing his coverage of the election.

Why not commission some other viewpoints? They do not need to be pro-Obama or pro-McCain necessarily, but simply why not publish something else? It's not enough just to hear what is becoming an increasingly strange and one-track stream of consciousness from Mr Stephen.

Jonny Mac
05 June 2008 at 17:26

"It is simply outrageous, for example, that the validity of millions of votes cast in Michigan and Florida should remain in legal limbo merely because there are so many senseless rules and traditions."

Not true. What would be outrageous would be if they were counted. That would be far more unfair to those in those states who quite sensibly didn't vote because they were informed the votes wouldn't count.

frenchie
05 June 2008 at 17:55

The sheer flakiness of so many Obama supporters is well illustrated by some of the comments here. To say that anybody who does not worship at the feet of this man is 'right-wing' is so ridiculous it it hadly worth responding to. HE is the candidate who has taken more money from our evil pharmaceutical industry than any other candidate on either side, and John Pilger recently listed all the ways Obama is in the pockets of big money and the big political machine. HE is in favor of nuking Iran, invading Pakistan without their permission, increasing the US 'presence' around the world, giving Israel even more military support. And yet if you don't support him YOU'RE right-wing???

The Obama people are always wanting to fight. Stephens never says anywhere that Clinton should get the votes in Florida or Michigan, merely that it's outrageous that the votes of millions should still be in some kind of legal no-man's land. If the Obamamaniacs carry on like this, they'll make defeat in November certain and put a 72-year-old right-wing Republican into the White House. Sadly, it would be purely as a result of this kind of mindless Obamaphilia. Can these people get real, please?

frenchie
05 June 2008 at 17:58

PS: Do the Obamamaniacs really think it's RIGHT to disenfranchise millions of voters in Florida and Michigan? Any sane observer can see the machinery badly needs reviewing, as Stephens rightly say. Now, will people stop banging on about this once and for all?

Concede
05 June 2008 at 19:34

Why this fight. You don't like Obama vote McCain. You hate McCain vote Obama. The one with more votes wins. If you vote McCain, wait until the effect of Vietnam style turture catches up with him @73 yrs. I am not afraid to try Obama, his judgements are accurate and better than McCain's, what with him loosing his 'bearings'?

Concede
05 June 2008 at 19:43

Frenchie, you need help. It was not Obama that disenfranchised millions of Florida and Mchigan voters. Neither was it Obama's supporters. The rules are laid down by the leaders of the party. The Republicans also punished states that held early voting. Stop complaining and ask Mrs Clinton to concede for the good of the party and America. You seem to forget that even McCain once lost to GW Bush. What are you lots blaming Obama for? Is it wrong to win?

frenchie
05 June 2008 at 23:32

Can you not even READ, any of you Obama people? I said nothing whatsoever about Obama or his supporters disenfranchising anybody. What I was clearly saying about Michigan and Florida, and Stephens was saying in his article, is that it is scandalous that millions were disenfranchised in the first place. This wasn't Obama's fault and it wasn't Clinton's fault - it was the fault of stupid people who make stupid rules and regulations in the Democratic party and the States. They end up producing a situation that is unfair and inequitable and intolerable, and it's not really relevant whether it's Obama or Clinton who gains or loses: the scandal is that either should be placed in this situation in the first place, and that hugely important decisions could rest on such unsatisfactory arrangements. Clear? Now, will you Obamaphiles PLEASE stop whining? You protest so much you almost sound as though you know you didn't win fairly and squarely...

cpark3r
06 June 2008 at 02:38

I believe it is as appropriate not to count Michigan and Florida, as it is for Clinton not to count the caucus states in order to claim her "majority". The fact that Clinton would spin the numbers in such a way now as a candidate makes me wonder what numbers she would spin as Cheif Executive.

And as for the disenfranchisment of the Michigan and Florida voters it is indeed scandalous. The blame for that lies squarely on the shoulders of the Democratic party leaders in those states who were warned in advance of the ramifications of elections held prior to Super Tuesday. I think it is a losing situation for both Obama and Clinton supporters, because we will never really know what the desire of the electorate in those states really was.

Paul
06 June 2008 at 13:30

Andrew,

There is a deeper question : why, at the time that the world is waking up to personal responsability, should the USA turn towards the big bad state?

Is america no longer the Land of Opportunity? Do immigrants, legal and illegal, not prosper?

Europe suffered the WW's and the Cold War; it gave a regimental dimension which spawned the vast socialist government control and benefits machines.

Eventually the political classes ( what? - children of left politicals ! no political classes in Marx! ) admitted to being FAILURES. Remember? Just the coining of the term political classes is an admission of defeat: no people allowed!

The socialist governments have admited to being failures, looking for profits to tax to pay out promised benefits - pensions.

Ever since it's begining the USA has not had such an attitude, instead the adventurer and pioneer were rewarded above the average, some even accumulated huge money and power; did not stop newcomers from advancing.

So why, now that the socialists of Europe are stuck and on the verge of bankruptcy, turn to a failed model for medical care?

Does it not show the mental shortcommings of the democrats? Or does it validate the notion that blacks are inferior?

I ask this question while living in a country were a working socialist model - heavy government interference - is collapsing as public services become dangerous, even Genocidal of 5 million- where is Milliband?

Therefore I hope that John M wins; he is with the right policies and views. I consider both BO and HC to be catalists of global disasters, like their buddies around the world.

antileft
06 June 2008 at 14:14

Paul I agree with you on most of that. And I commend you for not being the usual whining, NS leftie loser. But are you saying that Europe's healthcare is worse than America's? You are aware that Americans spend DOUBLE what europeans do on their healthcare system, right? Twice as much as a percentage of their GDP? Thats one hell of a burden. Hey, I hate socialism more than anyone- but when it comes down to health, Europe is doing better here. Unless you think that Mcain's ideas will somehow halve he cost of their system?

LTT
06 June 2008 at 14:17

A few remarks on Mr. Stephen’s insightful and generally unbiased piece (no matter what some may say):

"[…] this year's presidential election on 4 November will not be as different as we once thought it might be."

Let’s consider this very carefully, shall we? Yes, Obama is a man. Yes, he is well-educated. Yes, his viewpoints are at first glance not radically different from other Democrats (although we may still be surprised. I refer you to him urging the DNC to stop taking money from lobbyists). And also, he is black. Whether you like the man or not, his colour of skin most certainly makes his candidacy and thus this election historic. Don’t take that away from the US.

"[Obama] will be less than three years from his sixth decade."

Quite true, and out goes the argument that he is too young.

"[…] the absurd, outdated and ludicrously complex and contradictory procedures that govern US elections badly need to be updated and rationalised."

I agree. In modern times, there is no need for something as ridiculous as delegates, let alone superdelegates. The same goes for caucuses. You may already have gleaned that I am a supporter of Mr. Obama, who has won the nomination in large part thanks to the caucuses, but I still firmly believe they are a system of the past, that does not take into account every individual vote as we would expect in any modern democracy. Also, why not hold all the primaries in one single day? It’s possible, every other election is done in one day. It would eliminate all the rancour, all the dirty politics and campaigning. And it would probably save quite a bit of money. Not a bad idea, on the whole. And Mr. Stephen is of course absolutely right in denouncing all the other ‘anomalies’ (as he so euphemistically puts it) in the electoral system. Maybe, just maybe, in the near future we may see some changes there…

"[…] it is clear that more Americans actually cast their vote for Hillary Clinton to be the Democratic nominee than for Obama."

I’m sorry, but it isn’t all that clear. How do you count the votes? Do you include Florida and Michigan? Do you exclude caucuses? I already agreed that the system needs to be cleared out, but as long as it remains, it is nearly impossible to agree on popular vote counts. Some will say Hillary won the popular vote, with powerful arguments. Others will say Obama won the popular vote, with equally powerful arguments. There is no deciding it.

"No presidential candidate in history has ever lost six of the country's seven largest states in the primaries, as Obama has done, and gone on to win the White House."

A cause for concern indeed, but do not count Obama or the Democratic Party out for this election based on this single fact. Obama may still come to terms with blue-collar voters, latino voters, rural voters. Nonetheless, a difficult road winds its way towards the future…

gezworld
06 June 2008 at 20:31

Simply put, Obama ran a better, stronger and more strategically effective campaign than Clinton. End of story. And as far as Hillary winning the "popular vote," I don't really see how winning a 55 - 40 victory over 'Uncommitted' in Michigan puts her in the lead.

Why does everyone seem so eager to strip Obama of his justly won victory? Why can't we enjoy the fact that a vast number of Americans turned out in droves to vote (in many cases for the very first time) for an essential newcomer, an African-American male whose middle name is "Hussein?" That, in itself, is an admirable and historic accomplishment.

Incidentally, polls here in the United States show Obama leading over McCain at 47 to 44, versus Clinton at 45 to 44, so I wouldn't be so quick to sound the gong just yet.

And finally, I find it tedious when journalists feel the need to see the 'big picture,' and write things like: "No presidential candidate in history has ever lost six of the country's seven largest states in the primaries."

Well, no presidential candidate in American history has ever been an African-American. No presidential candidacy in history has ever been decided by the Supreme Court, as it was in 2000. And we all know how THAT turned out. Please stop generalizing and let things play out the way they will play out. I think we will all be pleasantly surprised.

spankerit
07 June 2008 at 03:16

The way the media, DNC and Obama's team played Hillary is just "unforgetable."

The bad news for Senator Obama is, that his opponent is John McCain, and not any kind of "Republican," John Mc Cain while being captured in Vietnam had the chance to be release before end, he refused saying " We all go or I don't go", stayed with his commrads until the end of the war, its what is call a REAL HERO", he's also known for " integrity" and on paper, he's a nearly ideal candidate for America: strong among veterans, Hispanics, and potentially among (lots of new) independent and swing voters.

That being said, Senator John McCain's record of independent work on the big issues that are facing our country and his willingness to work across party lines, make him the type of Republican who can transcend the current political environment."

Senator Hillary Clinton is "Une Grande Dame" it's such a pitty that Americans did not see it that way.

I am from the grassroot of a longlife Democrat and I NEVER, EVER taught I will be defending a Republican. Scary isn't???

cpark3r
07 June 2008 at 04:02

Alas ... had it only been McCain vs Gore in 2000. It sounds like such a win win compared to the last 8 years...

Cybertiger
07 June 2008 at 11:13

@spankerit

"Scary isn't???"

All Amerikans are scary - and a democratic majority are scared.

Carl Jones
07 June 2008 at 14:09

This weekend the Bilderberg Group are meeting at the Westfields Marriott in Chantilly. The air exclusion zone around Camp David has been extended to cover Chantilly. Bush, Obama, Hilary and McCain are in the vacinity.LOL I suppose one could call this "the last interview"lol

BBC News 24 took a call from George Osborn. The call was about the Tory money scandle, the BBC went on to say that Osborn was calling from Washington.LOL Ken Clarke is also attending.

Remember those controversial Muslim cartoons? Well, Rose Flemming editor of Jylland Posten (Jutland Post) is also at this years Bilderberg bash. At previous BB meetings Anders Eldrup has attended, his wife Merete Eldrup is the MD of JP/Politikens Hus A/S and they own the Jutland Post.....

.....but of course, this is just the surface. About two weeks ago, al-Qaeda (NWO construct) threatened attacks on those responsible for the Muslim cartoon outrage. A week later and the Danish Embassy gets bombed in Pakistan.

The crater....well, its not a crater, its a depression in the road, you can see the spiders web of fractured tarmac. The USAToday link put its depth at 3ft. Remember, this depression was caused by compression. Conventional explosives cannot do this, as they work creating pressure. In a car bomb, the pressure wuold find the easiest route, through the car windows, blowing off the doors and so on. the floor of the car (strongest part of bodywork) is supported by suspension and the tyers, so you can imagine the staggering force required to form a 3ft depression in a hard road. The 1000lb Amagh bomb didn`t even mark the road!

If you watch the video in the BBC link, you will see a very badly burnt tree, the tree has been broken and is still smoking from the ""INTENSE HEAT"". I`d say the tree break is at about 7/8 feet judging by camera angle and distance. Now watch the video again, you can see trees which are almost untouched with destruction all around....as you can work out, this tree has suffered more damage than a lightning strike could do, as its charred all over. There is no way a conventional explosive can do this. Of course, this is not the first time the NWO has used advanced micro nukes/near critical weapons.

http://www.usatoday.com/news/world/2008-06-03pakistan-blast_...

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/south_asia/7430721.stm

I might add, it appears that the Brown government is not using D-Notices like Blair did. There is no way that Blair would have allowed these pictures and video. The BBC never showed detailed puctures of Bali, Jakarta, Taba Hilton and Rafik Hariri`s assassination...all and more have involved the use of low yield micro nukes, or near crticallity weapons....Muslim terrorist don`t have access to this technology.

Its a full circle; a direct link between terrorism and the NWO bilderberg Group and their sick crusade against the Muslim world....it doesn`t matter who gets into the Whitehouse, the script is being written as I tap away and the most motivated actor will get the part.LOL

Its a scary NWO show.LOL

joga1
07 June 2008 at 19:19

After reading two articles written by this guy I'm convinced he doesn't know $#·+.

Carl Jones
07 June 2008 at 19:44

joga1: so why do you feel the need to express such an opinion? Surely it must be obvious to you that EVERYONE holds the same opinion as you do....its like saying the sky is blue.lol

I shall tell you somthing, I don`t care what you think....I wouldn`t care if you could find another 99 people who would comment along your lines. If I can get just one person to look at things from another perspective, then I will call that a success.

Maybe you would like to be specific....maybe you can find a genuine weak point in my comment.....

.....I`m waiting.

balra
07 June 2008 at 21:33

A Floridian and registered Democrat, I decided not to vote in the primary, which would have taken about an hour in all, because it seemed from what I had read that my vote would not count. Not exactly disenfranchisement, because a party is not a government. My guess is that many made this same decision. I blamed only the state Democratic Party, legislators specifically, for flouting the national organization's rules. Now due to Clinton's pressure and general DNC feebleness it turns out that half my vote was countable. That's even more annoying. But please don't call those who voted in this supposed beauty contest "disenfranchised".

spankerit
08 June 2008 at 08:01

Does anyone know where I can get a bumper sticker "Democrat for Mc Cain". George Stephan is right if neither of them have the necessary pledge vote and still 789 super delegates on the ballot, why she concede today why she didn't wait till Denver???

By the way thanks "cybertiger" I feel more secure knowing I'm not the only one scare.

Cybertiger
08 June 2008 at 09:52

@spankerit (luv the moniker)

"By the way thanks "cybertiger" I feel more secure knowing I'm not the only one scare."

Actually, I meant to say that the democratic majority of Americans are scary ... and the disenfanchised of the rest of the world are the ones who are really scared.

Carl Jones
08 June 2008 at 11:19

This is interesting analysis.http://www.rense.com/general82/ztz.htmWhile I don`t agree with all that is postulatated in the above link, Rockefeller is a very regular Bilderberger. and James Schlesinger is attending this Bilderberg bash in Chantilly (US). Schlesinger is big in defence, first Secretary of Energy under Carter, was very forcefull on the need to develope more sophisticated nuclear weapons, like the widespread use of micro nukes we see today (Danish Embassy bomb) and the sort of nukes which can get through 100ft of rock before detonation. Schlesinger was also head of the CIA and yes he is an elite ---.There may well be a factional struggle going on in the NWO. The UAF purge is one of many. The CIA was purged after 9/11. General Fallon was forced to quit his Middle East command....oh yes, there is plenty of dissent within the NWO middle management and these are the surface ripples form dark deep and very powerful under-currents....not the sort of stuff you read in The Telegraph, or Newstatesman.Back to the link; are we looking at "change"....has the NWO given up on illegal invasions, are we moving towards a nuclear WW3 with Russia and China?

This begs another question; does the US/EU have the ability to defend itself from nuclear attack?

Carl Jones
08 June 2008 at 13:10

http://www.rense.com/general82/ztz.htm

Strange how my last comment lost its paragaphs near the link. I`ve used this link on other sites and it works. When I posted on the BBC Radio 4 Today forum (was censored just before me being banned from the BBC) before it became totally censored, many of my links were broken by the dark forces. The Today message boards have now been closed down.lol

antileft
08 June 2008 at 14:15

"has the NWO given up on illegal invasions, are we moving towards a nuclear WW3 with Russia and China?"

A DIRECT contradiction of what you said before- you already said that the NWO doesnt want a nuclear war because it would "cause too much damage for the 'chosen ones' left alive". Whoops, ay, Carl?! Just shows how you dont actually have this NWO fantasy thought through properly. You just think out your justifications when people ask- even if your justifications completely contradict each other. get over it, Carl. It's a fantasy- and a not very enjoyable one at that.

No wonder you cant get a real job.

Carl Jones
08 June 2008 at 18:35

No, its not a contradiction on my part. I am refering to the link, which I have already stated that I don`t agree with on certain points. I mentioned James Schlesinger and his desire for more advanced nukes....this was a long time ago. In the 1960`s/71, the US military had the Davy Crockett....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/W54

....the DC was a little larger than a shoebox.

http://em.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nuclear_weapons_and_the_United_...

keeping it simple: they used a small atomic weapon to make the newer big weapon work. As you can work out, they had the DC in the 60`s. I believe they have nukes the size of a tennis ball today....its called the Nadal!LOL Disregard the last statement. We have no idea how clean these weapons are. More importantly, we don`t know if they can now make large clean nukes and if we can do this, can the Russians?

Most peoples mindset it still locked onto the US attack on Japan and what the MSM shows you....this is really old technology.

The last commentor has misunderstood what I`ve said. While I don`t agree with everything in the link article, I am willing to consider it....this article suggests that a dominant power faction in Washington is about to unleash a nuclear war against Russia and China.

Why hasn`t Bush hit Iran? Why hasn`t Israel hit Iran? Maybe things have become so serious for the NWO, that their hand is being forced.

All I`m trying to do is debate. It is unfortunate that some don`t read (listen) that well. While I understand the NWO use of micro nukes in their sham war on terror, I don`t yet understand the idea that our leaders have large clean nukes and if this is right, then the linked article might be nearer the truth.

As I said, we should be worried that James Schlesinger is at this years Bilderberg Group Meeting.

gumchewer
08 June 2008 at 20:03

why cant all you blowhards just be grateful for the brilliant analasyes we're getting from the us and for the new statesman for geiing the chance to publish tme? well done, the ns.

Carl Jones
08 June 2008 at 22:09

LOL....the dark forces are busy.LOL

'Victoria Brecon
09 June 2008 at 13:30

I absolutely agree with Stephens. It is inevitable that in the next few months each side will try to knock out the other with secrets they have driven underground. But neither side will be able to hide anything in the coming months..

Even though both sides differ on most of the issues, it will be their past behavior especially past public behavior, that will sink the candidate. I would never vote for McCain and the unknown and very flawed Obama I distrust because of the person I fear he is.

another one
10 June 2008 at 22:34

Mr. Stephen, will you be writing anything on where the money in the US primaries came from? Heard an interview with George Soros on the BBC worldservice the other night. At the end of it he said he'd spend more than 20 mill $ in the 2004 election on the Democratic candidate (Kerry). He is now backing Obama but chooses to stay in the background since he consideres himself a 'controversial character'(sic!). Seems money has a lot to do with superdelegates, since they're all up for election in some capacity or other and need funding. As they say, 'follow the money'. The American journalists in MSM ( a hoard) nor the blogs seem to be on the ball on this. Would be really great if a REAL journalist with a spine, such as you! would follow this up! Thank you for the latest two really great articles in a magazine I'm a great admirer of! Keep up the good work!

taghioff.info
12 June 2008 at 04:37

@Isabel

A breath of fresh air:

"This is not bad faith on the part of politicians (she says in optimistic tone) but political expediency as to go back to my original point modern capitalist democracies with their huge vested interests, lobbies and powerful pressure groups will never allow anyone with radical leftish political programmes to be elected."

This is a solid point, and is linked to the international economy and [lack of] polity. This phenomenon can also be seen in Brazil - Lula started on the left and went to centre right, and in many other countries.

It is because it is very hard to buck the market. If you push too far to the left, then capital can migrate from your country.

Since there is no meaningful democracy at the Global scale to match the internationalisation of the economy, it is very hard to push forward a politics that involves social standards.

There is a startling lack of social-policy standards globally, and capital has got good at racing to the bottom (although it returns to the top even faster in the form of massive returns on investment.)

This is despite opinion poll after opinion poll that shows that most voters in most countries (including the US) want a mixed economy with strong forms of social protection.

So until we get a meaningful global polity, then our national democracies will continue to be hollowed out to quite a great extent. In other words, if we want strong democracies, then we need global democracy.

James
12 June 2008 at 11:07

1. The world is being run by a species of super-intelligent lizrads in body suits.

2. The world is not being run at all but the events that happen in it are the direct result of power relationships within social processes. Some interest groups gain more from this than others and can influence their respective power relationships more.

3. The world is a hunky-dory Ricardian Game steered by an invisible hand of providence. Everyone and everything will be OK in the end.

frenchie
12 June 2008 at 22:26

Good stuff, Andrew - and dead on the button, as usual. Pay no attention to the loonies.

James
13 June 2008 at 10:27

"Pay no attention to the loonies."

Well I never!

gondwanaland
13 June 2008 at 12:41

"Bush, had Gore made it to the White House instead of him in 2000, would doubtless have suffered the same bitterness and resentment over being cheated of the presidency that subsequently afflicted Gore."

Except Obama and Clinton are on the same side which rather makes the analogy irrelevant.

Once again Stephen fails to mention the elephant in the room.

It's the war stupid!

Obama's campaign succeeded because he opposed the it, while Clinton lost large swathes of the democrat vote for supporting it.

As if that wasn't enough, HRC decided that at a crucial period in the primaries it was a good idea to start threatening to commit genocide by nuking Iran.

Fortunately, after 2 Bush terms many American's decided to dump the hawks and vote for someone with a more mature approach to the rest of the world.

Maybe Hilary should join the Republican Party. She'd certainly fit in nicely with the likes of Dick Cheney.

frenchie
16 June 2008 at 20:19

I think a wealthy upwardly mobile yuppie like Obama would be far more at home in the Republican party than Hillary Clinton, gondwanaland. He's supported every single bill funding the Iraq war since he became a Senator, said in 2004 that there were no differences between his position on Iraq and that of George W Bush. He also said he doesn't know how he would have voted in the Senate had he been there at the time. Talk about having it both ways!!! But, far more terrifyingly, HE is the candidate who wants to increase the size of the US military and its presence around the world - not Clinton, whose healthcare plans at least cater for the poorest 15 per cent of the population (unlike Obama's). He's far more dangrous than McCain because, gondwanaland, he adds stunning ignorance to the many lists of reasons why he isn't remotely qualified for the Presidency. Unfortunately it's not a joking matter, gondwanaland.

JoeyT
17 June 2008 at 04:51

Go read Andrew Stephen's May 2006 Duke lacrosse commentary. He just...makes up things. And hasn't the integrity to come back to the case.

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About the writer

Andrew Stephen

Andrew Stephen was appointed US Editor of the New Statesman in 2001, having been its Washington correspondent and weekly columnist since 1998. He is a regular contributor to BBC news programs and to The Sunday Times Magazine. He has also written for a variety of US newspapers including The New York Times Op-Ed pages. He came to the US in 1989 to be Washington Bureau Chief of The Observer and in 1992 was made Foreign Correspondent of the Year by the American Overseas Press Club for his coverage.

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